Rm4 into Fx unit sounds THIN..why???????????

Synergy/MTS Forum

Help Support Synergy/MTS Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

GtrGeorge!

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 22, 2007
Messages
1,681
Reaction score
3
Hi,
I love my rm4 and today hooked up 2 very good Fx units to it..no matter what it sounds thin.
Specifics: Rm4 serial out into Tc Gmaj 2 in and back into serial return.
I also tried the parrelel loop. I even dug out my Rocktron Chameleon and when thru that. same thin sound.
The best tone was the PRE out..into nothing. Really chunky and dynamic. But I NEED delay and Fx for my gigs.
WTF???????
Anybody else go thru this????
Its not a minor difference...its a big deal I could use some help. (not the usual "All Fx units suck man..."
Thank you for any help,in advance
GtrGeorge
your brother in tone
 
I run my RM4 in the effects loop of my effects unit, which is an old DigiTech GSP-2101, and I do not hear the "thin" sound you are hearing.

My signal chain is as follows:
Guitar into effects unit input.
Effects unit external loop send into RM4 input.
RM4 output into effects unit loop return.
Effects unit stereo outputs into amp or P/A.

Try this configuration to see if you hear a difference.
Hope this helps.
 
You might try different tubes for the FX loop. Genelex or Groove Tubes.
Also, jump the parallel loop with a small cable and turn the FX knob all the way to wet. These will both thicken up your tone.
 
What is your chain and what are you running into for amplification?

I'm assuming that you are putting the effects into the loop of the RM4?

If that is true as a suggestion why not try:

RM4->FX->power amp->speakers

Granted you may not want the FX on all the time, so if your unit is not midi bypass'able, you would be:

RM4->Switcher->FX->power amp->speakers

Works much better that stuffing things in loops of other rack units, but then I've never understood why you would want a loop on the RM4 so I guess thats just me :)
 
If you use the parallel loop, make sure the effects are 100% wet or have killdry enabled. Otherwise any dry signal from the effect will cause phasing issues when mixed with the dry signal from the amp; that will make your sound thin..

If you're running one effect into another in serial, using the serial loop, expect issues.

The best option is to use the Pre Loop Send with a splitter and a mixer. Then go directly from the mixer to your power amp.

I've used DIY splitters and midi audio routers and I prefer them far over an amp loop for maintaining tone and superior flexibility. I've used the RJM mini mixer with great results. Now I use a Switchblade 8F to handle both splitting and routing in any configuration I can think up; all while keeping my dry signal pure.
 
Thank you SO MUCH for the suggestions, I will try them. Its been a while since I dug out my trusty rm4....and that only makes my quandry deeper.
But to the point: Ive been doing acoustic gigs for the past 3-4 years and
I knew my brotIhers in tone would help........................................... (that's all of you good guys here at MTS) who UNDERSTAND need to ROCK out and play LOUD.
I'm on it...
GtrGeorge
 
Two things to keep in mind:

1: If you run your effects in series, simply run the Pre-loop or Post-loop outs directly into the effects unit, then from the effects unit to your power amp. There is absolutely no reason at all to use the series loop and Bruce even removed it from the M4 due to the redundancy. You avoid excess circuitry and extra cables.

2: If a loop ever sounds bad, do take a serious look at what you are using in it, how it's hooked up and your gain staging between the units. Contrary to popular belief, most gear doesn't have "crappy, tone-sucking loops" and I've never seen that as a design goal by any builder. Most of the time there is something not being used correctly or set up wrong.
 
I just found my RM4 has a bad signal leak to the main post fx outputs. Not sure if it's normal (shouldn't be!) but if you have the same problem you will get some phase issues even when using serial loop. This makes my "serial" loop pretty useless. Do your post fx outputs get any signal even with master all the way down?
 
Top