Let's talk preamp tubes and positions..

Guys, it has come to my attention that JJ's are known as being "darker". Right now, I've got pretty much JJ's in the fixed portion of the preamp in my Lynch box. I'm wondering here, could they be the reason why I am running my presence almost wide open? I am running at about 4 o clock on the presence. Sounds great to my ears but I'd like to figure out why this amp now seems a little low on the presence. What are your experiences? In V1 and V2 of the modules I have an assortment of tubes. Some are what i had kicking around (prob cheap chinese) and some were NOS that I borrowed from my Laney. I have some unused chinese that I have been thinking of swapping in. I also have some Sovtek EL34's which i could run in place of the JJ's. Would there be noticable difference?

Just about any tube you use will be brighter. I'd stick your EHX tubes in the amp and check it out. I prefer Tung Sol, and a NOS 5751 in the Phase Inverter, which breathes a lot of life into the tone as well.

I have a matched 12AX7 that i bought for the phase inverter but where is it actually in the Randall design?? Is it V2 of any of the modules?? That is what confuses me. At home I have a Tung sol I could use as well.

Kapo_Polenton said:

I have a matched 12AX7 that i bought for the phase inverter but where is it actually in the Randall design?? Is it V2 of any of the modules?? That is what confuses me. At home I have a Tung sol I could use as well.

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The preamp spot closest to the power tubes in the amp is the PI. I prefer a 5751 in that spot. I find that it gives me more usuable range on the gain knob.

In the modules, the pre on the left (when looking at the front of the module) is V1. Other than dropping a 5751 into the V1 spot to tame some gain, I don't pay too much attention to what pre's are in there. Chinese, Tung Sol, EHX, etc... are close enough for Rock N Roll for me. I will use JJ's in V2 if it's already there.

Another thing, what amp are you running? I found that the 2 RM50 combo's I had were much darker sounding than 2 RM100's I had at one time.

I'm running a 100watt Lynchbox down two tubes as a 50 watter. I suppose that might also affect the tone.

I use ARS 12AX7's in every module and in every position in the RM100 head.

I couldn't be happier with the results and have no need to experiment.

Mike P said:

I use ARS 12AX7's in every module and in every position in the RM100 head.

I couldn't be happier with the results and have no need to experiment.

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I forgot that I have a couple of those too. Sound great and they are easy on the wallet.

Kapo_Polenton said:

I'm running a 100watt Lynchbox down two tubes as a 50 watter. I suppose that might also affect the tone.

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Got it set to 1/2 the actual cab impedance? What output tubes? What speakers? These things will have a bigger impact on perceived bright/darkness of the sound than any preamp tube ever will.

JJ's in my experience aren't "darker", but a little smoother than say an EH or a Sovtek. The most neutral tube I've found for the PI is the Sovtek although like others have said, the JAN 5751 sound good to with lower input gain. Tung Sol seem to have an upper mid bump. The PI is one of the hardest working tubes in a tube amp so don't skimp on quality there.

Yes I have the amp set at half impedance of the cab - 4 ohm feeding an 8 ohm cab. Speakers are greenbacks and Lynch Super V's. JJ EL34 output tubes. All JJ from the looks of it but my modules have some ARS in there, some chinese, and one has some NOS which i can't even identify. I have a matched chinese i think i am going to throw in the PI.

Where do you guys purchase your ARS preamp tubes from? The canadian dealer I usually use doesn't stock those. If they are essentially shuagang chinese 12ax7b's though, I won't bother. I do have them in my Brahma from what I can tell and I dig that module. definitely going to do a V1 and PI swap tonight though. Time to go all chinese! Maybe try some KT77's in place of the EL34's as well. I remember really liking those in my plexi clone.

You can get ARS tubes from VooDoo Amps or direct from ARS.

I think Trace at Voodoo told me that they test/screen the ARS tubes they sell.

ARS are Chinese tubes imported by ARS Electronics in L.A. They also sell other brands and NOS.

Just do this for me...

If you wanna be a cork sniffer and dig the NOS or expensive tubes that all the nay sayers will say are not worth it...Just buy one Genelex Gold Lion 12AX7 and tell me it's the same as common tubes....Maybe I hear what I wanna hear....Maybe you will too...Who knows....But I say Genalex at about 35 bills a tube on the bay are the top for me....ARS's are the best value for certain....Plus, you gotta get everything else in line too with cables, speakers, pickups and so on first...

But if you go searching for a better tube- it's the Genalex - hands down...

Bash away boys!

I swapped some preamp tubes out, a chinese shuagang in V1 made a bit of diff in terms of clarity but still, I am starting to think that these Lynchboxes are just darker amps? I really dig the presence on almost 5 for some reason.

Not sure I'm ready to go the NOS route again.. I have a few already and I can't say there is that huge of a diff as to be honest, some have labels worn off them so i am not even sure what the hel they are! I got them from a fella named tubetramp on the metro forum years ago for my laney.

Nothing will be as big/thick and detailed as a JJ. Use JJ's for the core of your tone and polish around it with others. Tung-Sol are good for brightness, EH are harsh and less defined but have a nice fizz, NOS are waste of time. Like Gerald Weber says, "if a guy bought 200 preamp tubes in 1950, then kept the best 50 and sold the rest to another guy, who he kept the best 50 he could find, and sold the remaining 100 to the next guy in 1990, this guy would salvage what is left of anything half decent, who then sells the remaining 70 tubes to another guy or ebay" resulting in high prices for not so great tubes! Ofcourse the high risk of them being microphonic also!

JJ's are cheap and easily replaceable, just a pity about the quality control....

Sovtek LPS in the phase inverter is a must also! its like a JJ but brighter, and because it's in the phase inverter doesn't affect the tone like it would normally. A JAN5751 in phase inverter like most guys seem to do is what will also darken your tone. (i have 5 of these puppies)

You asked! Just my 2 cents!

shaugang's are narrow sounding, have nice gain, but kind of sound flat and direct! and when you crank them in a band mix will wonder why your tone is thinner sounding....

There is something to be said about not worrying about tubes so much and load everything with a standard brand...

People all have their own tastes and a tube won't make or break a module but IMHO they can make an OK module good on occasion and they can also make a good module great....Depends on what you're after...But spending big bucks on tubes is generally frowned upon around these parts for good reason...There's plenty of other factors that need to be addressed before you play with tubes anyway...

I fall on the other side and play with tube configs all the time....It's kinda part of the fun for me though...I've amassed a nice collection of tubes and, to my ear, they can make a tonal difference that is enough for me to care...Here's why...If I used all the same tubes with my collection of modules- I'd have much more tonal crossover between modules....Yes, I could just narrow it down to four modules and use cheap tubes and be just fine...But now I'm at 15 mods and tubes are one of the best ways to make allow each module to be it's own thing...

But don't listen to me as I'm obviously WAY overboard on MTS....

:lol:

i agree Mattfig! very true with so many modules!

A 5751 in the phase inverter will darken the tone? Will it make the Lynchbox sweeter sounding? I noticed that my RM50's are a little sweeter sounding but not as full as the 100 Lynchbox... Any reason for this? Or is it that I just can't crank it up enough?

Where do you guys run your presence anyway?