Pedals in loops

I have recently designed a small box to adapt high level loops (Egnater Modular/ Randall MTS, etc) to work with any pedals. It is powered with an 18 volt wall wart (no battery), has in/out/send/return jacks with send and return levels. Easily solves the pedals in the loop issue once and for all. Could also be used to insert pedals between a preamp and poweramp.Planning to produce a small number of them that will sell direct for around $150(USD). I wan't to get an idea of how many to make before ordering parts, boxes, boards etc. Also would allow you to mix line level/rack gear with pedals in the same loop simuntaneously. Any interest?? Should be available around mid May.

email me to get on the list.

[email protected]

Is it possible to redesign it to work off of 9V?
I think that would make it much more convenient for a lot of people.

It can't run on 9VDC and still handle the higher level signals. It is the small sacrifice for having a very wide dynamic range. The reason most pedals distort in a higher level loop is because the do not have the required voltage swing, because they only run on 9 volts. The box can actually run on anything from 9VDC to 25VDC. The higher the supply voltage, the more signal it can handle and the better job it can do. It may very well work in certain setups with a 9VDC adapter. It would depend entirely on the signal level at the loop in that particular rig.

bruce egnater said:

It can't run on 9VDC and still handle the higher level signals. It is the small sacrifice for having a very wide dynamic range. The reason most pedals distort in a higher level loop is because the do not have the required voltage swing, because they only run on 9 volts. The box can actually run on anything from 9VDC to 25VDC. The higher the supply voltage, the more signal it can handle and the better job it can do. It may very well work in certain setups with a 9VDC adapter. It would depend entirely on the signal level at the loop in that particular rig.

Click to expand...

Right. Maybe running modules low and master high you could get away with 9V dc.
Anyway, thanks for the clarification. :wink:
I don't plan on running any pedals any time soon except for those suited for higher levels, but I think it's a good idea nonetheless!

Thanks Bruce! While I don't have that problem, it's super cool to know the man himself is here to support us and solve a very common problem...

All hail Bruce Almighty!

I'm in!

Wrong email address in first post....hmmm

Correct is [email protected]

Should be a sticky.

I'm probably missing something obvious, but I'm seeing many people use some fairly expensive/elaborate set ups for using pedals in the loops, but I'm using an ebtech line level shifter and it works flawlessly, without batteries. Better yet, I got in on ebay for 20 bucks.

From what I can tell (can't crank it in my apartment) there's no noticable tone degradation from the ebtech....

If the Ebtech wworks for your setup, that's great. Some have tried it with not as stellar results. I have been recommending the Ebtech for a long time. I have seen and/or received many inquirees about an alternative. That is why I came up with this gadget. One thing I did find with the Ebtech that can be an issue is, because it uses passive transformers for the level shifting, it can be sensitive to what is connected to it. If you are using pedals with "true bypass" switching, in some instances the volume level will noticeably change when switching the pedal in/out. I'm sure it works great for many situations. For those who find it does not work for them, now there is an alternative.

Thanks Bruce! I'm not in need, but I'm sure others are...

Thanks Bruce. I went all rackmount and sold off the pedals though. The effort is appreciated anyway.

I would definitely be interested! I am going back to analog pedals after several years with rack mount and floor based digital units. Bruce's device would be very helpful! I do have a question for those who have used these types of units; e.g., the ebtech? I am assuming that the line shifter steps down the signal coming out of the preamp so that it doesn't overload the pedals? Does it then step the signal back up prior to going into the power amp? If not, I assume that it would greatly effect the sound. Also, even if it does step the signal back up, wouldn't you essentially be steping down an all tube signal and then steping it back up via a solid state device? Does this somewhat defeat the purpose of using an all tube amp in the first place? I don't have a background in electronics or electrical engineering, so forgive me if I am totally misunderstanding how this all works.

In case Bruce doesn't get enough intereset to move forward with this, I am wondering about the ebtech Line Level Shifter. Can anybody that is using one tell me whether I will need one or two of these devices? I know that it is capable of converting either from -10 to +4 or vice versa, but does one device have enough inputs and outputs to step the signal down going into the pedals and then step it back up coming out, or will I need one going in and a second one coming out? I think Bruce's unit will be an all in one solution, but I am not sure about the ebtech?

The Loop matching boxes are shipping next week.
email me at [email protected] to discuss if it solves your issue. Sounds like it will. The ebtech may work but it is not adjustable. It has a preset send level attentuation and a preset return gain using transformers. If it works for you that's great. If not, this gadget is an alternate solution....

if anyone is interested, I would be willing to make a 9vDC to 18vDC box for this and other applications (buffers etc that handle 18vDC)

if you're interested, please shoot me an email: [email protected]

Loop boxes still in stock. Works with any amp where effects/pedals distort or cause tone loss in a loop.