Anyone go from Randall to Egnater?
- Thread starter JKD
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Man...Big question. I have the rack rig, started with the RM4, now have the M4 and single modules
I went full force and grabbed about all I could from both initially. I found more difference in modules than when I eventually moved to the Eggy rack. The beauty is that I can change the timbre based on whose version of a given module I choose
My modules are stock, Pete modded and Egnater. I'm sure I'll check out the new Randall and Egnaters after NAMM and will likely send more to Pete as well as get my MHG up for the EG5 mod.
Of course tubes and cables and speakers and guitars played a part in all of this too. It never ends.... 8)
I went full force and grabbed about all I could from both initially. I found more difference in modules than when I eventually moved to the Eggy rack. The beauty is that I can change the timbre based on whose version of a given module I choose
My modules are stock, Pete modded and Egnater. I'm sure I'll check out the new Randall and Egnaters after NAMM and will likely send more to Pete as well as get my MHG up for the EG5 mod.
Of course tubes and cables and speakers and guitars played a part in all of this too. It never ends.... 8)
JKD said:
3 Mile Stone
Well-known member
I'd agree. I have heard Eganater is better comments and I generally agree that that they are. I am 47 years old and enjoy more "seasoned" :lol: tones with complexity and detail. I also live in the tonal range where Eganter truly excels over the Randall, which is mid range overdrive, so I tend to favor the Egater modules mostly. Randall makes some GREAT freaking modules though so I don't get to caught up in the cork sniffer attitude. An artsist should use whatever tools work. The Randall Plexi, Brown, JTM & XTC are fantastic modules out of the box. I would bet that the Super V, KH1, KH2, Grail, Tweed, Balckface and others are really good although I have not tried all of them ... yet. I have focused mostly on getting modules that will get my sound live. That consists mostly of Egnaters. I like them because they are a little thicker and sweeter sounding. There are also subtle but noticable differences in the single and dual channel Egnaters. Bruce and Jeff/Hilly have mentioned here and on Rig Talk that they plan to release the Eganter Single channel modules for mass public consumption again. This is really good news for everyone, especially the Randall amp owners. Enjoy them all.
bduersch
Well-known member
I went through the Randall -> Egnater conversion as well, though not directly... I had a lot of MTS gear (RM4, RT250, RM100, RM20, 12 modules) and used it for extensive gigging & recording for about a year. In an effort to simplify, I sold the MTS gear and played H&K's for a while, then "re-discovered" the Egnater gear when I went to one of Bruce's amp building seminars last year. Now I've got an M4 for my main rig, but still use an RM50 extensively.
Overall, I find the Egnater modules to be a little bit smoother and more dynamic (at lower gain settings) than the Randalls. Not drastically different, but subtle. Suits my current band situation (more acoustic, poppy) better than the Randall modules, though at the time they were great for the hard rock band I was in.
--B
Overall, I find the Egnater modules to be a little bit smoother and more dynamic (at lower gain settings) than the Randalls. Not drastically different, but subtle. Suits my current band situation (more acoustic, poppy) better than the Randall modules, though at the time they were great for the hard rock band I was in.
--B
has anyone compared a randall recto to an egnater e-rect. i'm still searching for that great mesa tone but i can't get it from the recto and the grail i had was decent but not enough gain. the real mesa triple rectifier has lots of gain and sounds nothing like the randall recto and if it did i can't see how anyone would play one either. i've heard that the e-rect is right there with the mesa , just wondering if anyone has compared them. the recto has the worst crunch ever. its actually not crunch , i'm not sure what you'd call it but to my ears its not pleasant. i've tried c3 swaps and it seems on that module nothing can get rid of that flubby stiff bass responce
maximus1 said:
I'd love to hear that comparison too...as I've heard good things about the e-rect.
I thought the flubby bass response was a Mesa Rectifier personified...I do the same on my Randall as a real Recto....boost in front
I don't think you're going to get that full wall of sound response from a Recto module without a Mesa Rectifier power section.
The Recto/Grail modules I've had really liked the Ruby ax7c tube..made a world of difference compared to the stock EH rubbish
The Grail and Recto make a close impersonation of the Rectifier tones that I had dialed in..so much so that I sold both my Dual Rectifiers.
jkd, i really value your opinion on the recto and if you got rid of your mesa's for the randall i'd assume you know that tone well. i guess my problem is that i have never owned a dr or tr but i have played on them plenty and it seems they are capable of much more than what the randall brings. the voicing and open notes and such are great on the recto and grail and i definetly hear the mesa all the way for the most part but its that palm mute and crunch i just can't get over on it. i seem to prefer the eh's to most other 12ax7's but i do remember my 1086 sounding best with the stock ruby's so maybe i'll try some of those but generally the pre amps tubes don't change things dramatically but a good swap does help. as for boost pedals for me they add too much midrange and take away from the bass responce but then again i've only used tube screamers. i think that the recto needs to have a **** tone more gain to get that tight chunky palm mute instead of that laid back ultra saggy flubb. anyone know how to mod the recto for way more gain?
I've never played through a DR, but I've heard plenty in person. My take on the Recto is that I don't always like the open notes and banging on chords. There's no attack at all. Palm muting on the other hand is great (for me). I think I love it and then hate it and then back around again. I remember reading that it was based on the original DR? If that's the case then it's done a good job. I had a Mesa V-twin rack, which was also based on the original DR and the tone was same, but not as flubby or spongy just thick.
I've been trying to get my Modern close to a Recto. I think I am really close, including a switched "lead" mode.
Scott
I've been trying to get my Modern close to a Recto. I think I am really close, including a switched "lead" mode.
Scott
Probably ought to qualify this a bit with the tones I'm chasing/dialing to. I'm typically dialing to a Metallica Black Album/Load/Reload type tone and I think the Recto module cops this really well as a Dual Rectifier.
I could dial these sounds in easily in either Modern or Vintage mode on my Recto...obviously with the modern mode having a bit more of the Rectifier Buzz-saw grind
The Rectifier to me always was more of a 'splat' than a 'crunch' if that makes sense...it's the attack, sag and less clarity. The Recto module (to me) has greater clarity.
The Recto module doesn't sound as 'big' but I put this down to the power section. I think the sag and more liquidy feeling (especially in Vintage mode) is hard to cop....more mids and more gain help.
I dial in Bass on the module and use a TS type boost to push the mids and cut bass.....which is exactly what I would do on my real Mesa.
The Recto controls don't interact in exactly the same way as they do on a Mesa tho...one of the cool sounds on a real Rectifier was to dial out almost all the treble which would bring the mid voicing out and then compensate with more Presence...this can be approximated on the Recto using the Bright switch.
I'd love if an MTS head had the 'Spongy' Power setting
There are so many variables though..I mean cab/speakers, pickups but I'm using the same gear with my MTS that I used with the Mesa. (EMGs, v30s, ENGL or Randall 4x12 etc)
I could dial these sounds in easily in either Modern or Vintage mode on my Recto...obviously with the modern mode having a bit more of the Rectifier Buzz-saw grind
The Rectifier to me always was more of a 'splat' than a 'crunch' if that makes sense...it's the attack, sag and less clarity. The Recto module (to me) has greater clarity.
The Recto module doesn't sound as 'big' but I put this down to the power section. I think the sag and more liquidy feeling (especially in Vintage mode) is hard to cop....more mids and more gain help.
I dial in Bass on the module and use a TS type boost to push the mids and cut bass.....which is exactly what I would do on my real Mesa.
The Recto controls don't interact in exactly the same way as they do on a Mesa tho...one of the cool sounds on a real Rectifier was to dial out almost all the treble which would bring the mid voicing out and then compensate with more Presence...this can be approximated on the Recto using the Bright switch.
I'd love if an MTS head had the 'Spongy' Power setting
There are so many variables though..I mean cab/speakers, pickups but I'm using the same gear with my MTS that I used with the Mesa. (EMGs, v30s, ENGL or Randall 4x12 etc)
Apologies for anyone waiting on email or more from me - been without power since sunday, having to sneak internet at work pretty much. Ice storms are the suck.
Anyways, JKD - you can put a spongy switch on an RM100. Once I get power at home and everything is back to normal, I can share details.
Pete
Anyways, JKD - you can put a spongy switch on an RM100. Once I get power at home and everything is back to normal, I can share details.
Pete
JKD said:
basically you hook up a switch to the grounded B+ tap on the power supply with a zener diode - it can take some voltage off the B+ and 'brown' your amp up. You'd just want to double check the bias once you did that.
Pete
okstrat said:
I wonder if the Spongy switch on a Mesa does anything with the bias...I'm thinking it just lets it fall where it lands with the reduced voltage...we're WOT here now...sorry
If I ever get to having two MTS amps again, I'll send one to you for modding
Steve
P.S. I chickened out on buying the Mod50 on eBay..just couldn't quite hit the Buy It Now at $1350..although I think it would have been worth it.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=320192759984
MkIV
New member
JKD said:I wonder if the Spongy switch on a Mesa does anything with the bias...I'm thinking it just lets it fall where it lands with the reduced voltage...we're WOT here now...sorry
Yes the bold/spongy option on the Mesa Recto changes the plate voltage and so does the solid state/tube rectifier setting.
If your interested you can read about it here:
http://eurotubes.com/euro-n.htm
Best wishes,
Magnus
jdzialak
Well-known member
I started with an RM100 and moved to an M4. I wanted Dual channels and more modules.
Joe
Joe
I find I can get close to the Dual Rectifier sound with the Egnater ERECT module using Mesa, Ruby, or Sovtek WA tubes, a Tube Screamer in front for boost, and an EQ between preamp and power amp. The EQ makes a huge difference. Egnater modules tend to have a sweeter/wetter sound and I use the EQ to "dry" it up. I basically cut the mids and low mids using a U or V shape. I have the module scooped on the midrange (mid is very low but not off) and the bright switch is on 1. Bass and treble fluctuate depending on the type of tubes in the mod.
By itself the ERECT sounds good but it really gets chunky with the TS boost and EQ. I've never tried a Randall Recto/Treadplate but I'm guessing you can do the same with the right tubes, TS pedal, and EQ.
Edit: I recently picked up a Grail module. To me it sounds more refined than the ERECT due to a lot less gain on tap. I have not tried boosting it with the TS yet, but I will. The ERECT gets a lot closer to the real DR sound than the Grail, but neither sound _exactly_ like the real thing. IMO, the ERECT is close enough to keep me from wanting a DR.
The bold/spongy power amp switch sounds intriguing. I wonder how hard it would be to install on one side of an RT2/50...
Edit: I started with an RT2/50 and Egnater M4 after hearing clips and reading all the reviews. That combination is truly a tone monster. The Egnater modules are thick, clear, and really Hi-Fi sounding. I later picked up a few Randall modules that do not have an Egnater equivalent. Almost all of my Randall modules will be Pete modded. He does an awesome job of cleaning up the sound and adding more tonal abilities.
By itself the ERECT sounds good but it really gets chunky with the TS boost and EQ. I've never tried a Randall Recto/Treadplate but I'm guessing you can do the same with the right tubes, TS pedal, and EQ.
Edit: I recently picked up a Grail module. To me it sounds more refined than the ERECT due to a lot less gain on tap. I have not tried boosting it with the TS yet, but I will. The ERECT gets a lot closer to the real DR sound than the Grail, but neither sound _exactly_ like the real thing. IMO, the ERECT is close enough to keep me from wanting a DR.
The bold/spongy power amp switch sounds intriguing. I wonder how hard it would be to install on one side of an RT2/50...
Edit: I started with an RT2/50 and Egnater M4 after hearing clips and reading all the reviews. That combination is truly a tone monster. The Egnater modules are thick, clear, and really Hi-Fi sounding. I later picked up a few Randall modules that do not have an Egnater equivalent. Almost all of my Randall modules will be Pete modded. He does an awesome job of cleaning up the sound and adding more tonal abilities.
muudrock
Well-known member
I still own both and would agree with with what others have said. In general I find the Egnater gear to be a bit more refined and organic sounding. Conversely I like the Randall stuff for when I want a slightly more aggressive vibe.
I cannot make my RM100 sound like my MOD100 even with the same tubes and modules--2 different animals. I like both though. I do tend to play the Egnater most often because it is produces the tones I've heard in my head for years but could never get. The Randall is my back up right now. I've never been a gear snob but I truly believe the Egnater is the best of the best.
I cannot make my RM100 sound like my MOD100 even with the same tubes and modules--2 different animals. I like both though. I do tend to play the Egnater most often because it is produces the tones I've heard in my head for years but could never get. The Randall is my back up right now. I've never been a gear snob but I truly believe the Egnater is the best of the best.
Orren
Active member
I went from a MTS100 to a MOD50, and never looked back. I still have a soft spot for Randall, for a lot of reasons. My very first gig was played on an old Randall combo, back in 1993! I'd not hesitate to get some of the signature Randall Modules to use in my Egnater rig. Randall rocks, however I think that the Egnater stuff is worth the extra $$ it costs.
Orren
I still have a soft spot for Randall, for a lot of reasons. My very first gig was played on an old Randall combo, back in 1993! I'd not hesitate to get some of the signature Randall Modules to use in my Egnater rig. Randall rocks, however I think that the Egnater stuff is worth the extra $$ it costs.Orren
