Just got a new RM100...

[needsmoregear12]

Hello all!

After reading up on these amps and lurking on these forums, I started to look for a RM100 for a fair price. I found the 212 combo used in mint condition for only $550 so I decided to go with it and finally register to the forum!

The speakers in it are Celestian G12-60's. I thought they were supposed to be 75's?

The 3 modules it came with are Clean, Ultra, and Treadplate.
They are the full black face-plates.

Clean: I love it. 100% fully enjoy it. Not much else to say

Ultra: I feel like this would be my "lead" channel. It feels the gain COULD be very sweet and sing-y but I feel that its lacking. I feel that it gets muddy pretty quick. The bass is VERY boomy. And I thought it would have much more gain.

Treadplate: It honestly doesnt sound at all like I think It should. Ive played a Dual Rec for a brief time and it was completely different. This module is BEYOND boomy in the lower register, lacks a bit of gain, is quite muddy, and isnt voiced as tight/modern as I think it should be.

My amp before this (Which I still have) is a 5150 212 combo. That amp has godly amounts of gain so maby thats why Im disappointed? Should I save up for a Overdrive to run in the front and an EQ for the loop? Will those help me out?

Are there any simple mods that I can do and be able to find the supplies needed? I dont want to start ordering a bunch of stuff online. Id like to just make a trip to Radioshack and buy the components there.

Im not too handy with soldering but Ive got a friend who works with electronics who wouldnt mind helping me out.

Please somebody help me out, because I have 29 days to return this amp and unless I can get it sounding near what I want, Im gonna have to take it back.

Thank you guys in advance, your help is very much appreciated

 

[JKD]

After you're sure that the tubes you're using are not worn out (no way to usually tell other than age) and you've grabbed a multi-meter and made sure the bias is set correctly at the four test points....


The single biggest mod you can make to all high gain modules (except the XTC) is to improve their tone is to reduce the capacitance in C3.

Look for 500pF for super tight, 1000pF for more general use.

Some of these modules came with 2200 and 3300pf in C3....makes for a very boomy and muddy sound under high gain.

I still have an Ultra where I all I did was took the C3 value and basically halved it...it rocks...same with tread plate, it's likely to be too high.

From memory the stock caps are around 600 or 630V non-polarized and typically silver mica...but someone with more skill/knowledge will know for sure.

So we're talking a couple of $ in capacitors and a little care with soldering iron and you'll feel much better about those modules.

Also look in here:

http://mtsforum.grailtone.com/viewforum.php?f=26

There's a thread to turn a Treadplate into a Grail specification somewhere also....the Grail is a much improved Rectifier simulation.

 

[needsmoregear12]

Thanks for the quick reply!

All the preamp tubes in each module are new, I took out the old rubys and replaced them with a mix of JJ ECC83's, ECC803, Tung Sol 12AX7's, and Sovtek 12AX7LPS.

So theyre all pretty good tubes.

Ill test the bias points later today/tomorrow as Ive got a gefty amount of homework I should be working on...

And the caps will be available at a basic hardware store or Radioshack? I really dont know anything about this stuff, so Im just having faith In what you guys say

 

[audiomidijace]

A few basics to try and help:
1. Make sure your DENSITY knob isn't turned up too much. Start with it and the PRESENCE control at noon.
2. Each stock module has a BRIGHT switch. Turn it on and some of that mud should go away.
3. I believe you can remove a panel or two from the rear of the amp. This will open up the sound and remove some boom as well.

CLEAN-No frills, plane jane, but does the job. The Blackface will offer much more character.
ULTRA-Both of the Ultra modules (There's also an XL) are liquid gain modules. These are the highest gain stockers.
TREAD PLATE=sucks. Try trading or selling to get an XTC or SL+. If you really want a recto sound, look to Jaded Fatih, Sacred Groove or Salvation and have it modded.
Best of luck and welcome aboard.

 

[Whoopysnorp]

If it really is possible to mod your Treadplate into a Grail (and I think it should be considering they both use the same board) I'd recommend it. I've played a Treadplate and a Grail side by side and the Grail is miles better. It's not that far off from some of the highly-regarded modded Recto modules, honestly.

I'm sure you probably get a sense of this based on the content of this board, but getting modules modded by one of the guys doing it professionally is really where it's at. It definitely adds cost to the whole MTS equation, but there are some really excellent modded modules out there that will rival anything you can throw at them. I now own six modules, all of them modded. However, there are some good stock modules out there as well. The SL+ is quite good for high-gain Marshall tones. The Blackface is passable although I thought it was a little anemic. As mentioned, the Grail is good. The stock XTC is pretty good too although I felt that it lacked definition compared to the SL+ and the Grail.

 

[needsmoregear12]

Yea now im starting to see that all the hype of these amps is really from the modders. Thing is, Im pretty bad in debt at the moment, im only 17, and cant find a good stable job.

My parents would flip out If I started sending out modules to get modded!

Id really like to keep this amp, since potentially it could be my last "amp" for quite some time. But I just need a good quick/cheap fix for the time being until I can start trading/selling/modifying modules.

I tried finding the thread on changing the Treadplate to a Grail and couldnt find it

Im sorry if my questions are very repetitive, but can someone give me an exact sort of "Shopping list" on what I would need to mod all three modules? Im fine with the clean but if theres anything simple that can improve it then im all up for it.

Thank you all

 

[VitaminG]

these amps can get a bit boomy if you crank the lows & bump the density knob. What settings are you using for your Treadplate & Ultra? The guys here might suggest some settings that get you closer to your goal.

OD & EQ pedals are a cheap way to get you there. I've found all my modules quite responsive to a goose in the front end. And if you don't keep the amp, you can hang on to the pedals or return them too. Just be aware that the RM100 has a really hot loop - if the EQ you grab isn't up to it, it will generate distortion. Not what you want from an EQ.

I'd hesitate to go nuts modding your amp yet. You said you have 29 days to check it out. Will the retailer take it back if they see you (or your electronics friend) have been tinkering?

I'm absolutely certain that you could get what you want (and a whole heap more) out of this amp, but if you're not sure whether you're going to keep it yet, don't set to it with a soldering iron. All the modders have woeful tales of modules they've had to fix after amateurs found working on these PCBs more difficult than they realised.

 

[needsmoregear12]

Its guitar center, no disrespect if any of you guys work there but majority of the guys ive dealt with there are completely lost. They wouldnt even notice. Theyre so lost, they advertised that it came with a "Tweed" module. I opened the box when I got home from school today and I was gladly surprised it said "Treadplate".


I want to ATLEAST try the C3 mod JKD suggested.
For now im very welcome to trying out your guys settings. Im happy with my clean settings.

For distortion I want a sort of Older John Petrucci tone ala "Images and Words" or "Scenes from a Memory". I know he didnt use the rectifier series though, he abused his Mark IIC+ though and im not sure how I would get that tone with these modules.

How do you feel about the behringer 7-band EQ in the loop of this amp? I got to try it with my 5150 combo and it was almost the same as a Boss 7 band except a fraction of the price.

 

[alowerdeep]

I wonder if that is the same one I returned to guitar center?Did you get it online from birmingham,al?If so,I had problems with the midi switching on it and returned it...told them that it works as it should sometimes,but it will not work at all sometimes,noticed they listed it the next day.....Ive had 2 of the 100 combos and have had issues with both,not to mention, I think they sound horrid.....If you have a 4x12 run it though that....hope it isnt the amp I had......funny how subjective tone is,because I liked the tradplate,recto and rectified....very clear and articulate and hate the grail....just too dark,not alot of topend....and I like the stock clean alot....you just have to experiement and find what you like,listen to sound clips....it's most trial and srror since the modules are not commonly available to try out....

 

[Mike361]

The combo's can be boomy. First thing is get it off the floor and away from a corner. Put it on a bench whatever. Big difference. Now the obvious. Turn your bass and density down all the way if necessary. Like said before try to take off the back panel. And of course bias it on the hot side of the specs. These are easy and don't cost anything. Maybe trade for a less bassy speaker although I don't know anything about the 12 60's. If its still a problem then try the more difficult suggestions. I could not believe the difference just putting my combo on a amp stand made. I actually turned the density on for a change. Oh and welcome to the forum read and learn and stay out of the classifieds, it'll drive ya nuts. :lol:

 

[Whoopysnorp]

I don't know of a stock MTS module that will get you Mark series tones. You know, one thing that does come to mind is this: have you ever tried a Mesa Studio Preamp? It's basically the preamp section of a Mark IIC. They sound fantastic and a typical price for them on the used market is somewhere between $300 and $400. Of course it's just a preamp, no power amp, but you could run it into the effects return of your 5150 combo (though I can't vouch for the fact that that power amp pairs well with the Studio Preamp). May be something to think about. Alternately, the Jaded Faith Mark X module shows up on the used market for $225-$240 every once in a while. Flip the Treadplate or Ultra module for $120 or so, scrounge up the difference, and you've got killer Mark series tones for your RM100. The beauty (curse?) of MTS amps is you don't have to invest it all right away. You can do it piecemeal.

 

[alowerdeep]

The combo's can be boomy. First thing is get it off the floor and away from a corner. Put it on a bench whatever. Big difference. Now the obvious. Turn your bass and density down all the way if necessary. Like said before try to take off the back panel. And of course bias it on the hot side of the specs. These are easy and don't cost anything. Maybe trade for a less bassy speaker although I don't know anything about the 12 60's. If its still a problem then try the more difficult suggestions. I could not believe the difference just putting my combo on a amp stand made. I actually turned the density on for a change. Oh and welcome to the forum read and learn and stay out of the classifieds, it'll drive ya nuts. :lol:

I had it off the floor....I tired it in several room,ect....just didnt like it at all....was going to try speakers,but then I had issues with it and returned it....It sounded fine through the 4x12 I typically use,so I figured it was the spoeakers or the qulaity of the enclosure,though the amp seemed solid....was probably those speakers......Im just going to get another head....lol....

 

[needsmoregear12]

Alowerdeep: Yup. Seems I have yours! Wish they wouldve told me that there were some defects with the MIDI
It really is a small world we live in...

I think im gonna have to return it... I played with ti for awhile and I just wasnt happy. At first I was settling because I was just happy I had a new amp, but now that Im really thinking about it, Its just not worth keeping over my 5150.

 

[alowerdeep]

Alowerdeep: Yup. Seems I have yours! Wish they wouldve told me that there were some defects with the MIDI
It really is a small world we live in...

I think im gonna have to return it... I played with ti for awhile and I just wasnt happy. At first I was settling because I was just happy I had a new amp, but now that Im really thinking about it, Its just not worth keeping over my 5150.

Obviously thay didnt beleive me....lol....They have a 30 day return and you can return it if you just dont like it,which I told the guy I knew about,but I guess they still thought I was making it up....lol....Dont know how much time you've spent with it,but the first few hours I played it I had no problem.....then,when I powered it up none of teh modules would light up....I would flip it on/off a few times and it would work sometimes.....

 

[needsmoregear12]

I got it yesterday at about 4 pm. And yea, the first time I powered it up it worked fine, just didnt sound the way I expected it to. Second time none of the modules were light. Third It worked fine again.

Yea, Im gonna have to take it back then Im a bit upset, I had such high hopes for it and It mas a major let down lol. Oh well, Ill take it back, sell a pedal or two, save up some extra cash, and just find a Mesa Mark III. I know thats what I ultimately want, so I needa stop beating around the bush and just snatch one up already.

If you all know any sort of replacement/alternative to the Mesa Mark sound, please let me know! Thank you all

 

[needsmoregear12]

I don't know of a stock MTS module that will get you Mark series tones. You know, one thing that does come to mind is this: have you ever tried a Mesa Studio Preamp? It's basically the preamp section of a Mark IIC. They sound fantastic and a typical price for them on the used market is somewhere between $300 and $400. Of course it's just a preamp, no power amp, but you could run it into the effects return of your 5150 combo (though I can't vouch for the fact that that power amp pairs well with the Studio Preamp). May be something to think about. Alternately, the Jaded Faith Mark X module shows up on the used market for $225-$240 every once in a while. Flip the Treadplate or Ultra module for $120 or so, scrounge up the difference, and you've got killer Mark series tones for your RM100. The beauty (curse?) of MTS amps is you don't have to invest it all right away. You can do it piecemeal.

Your the second person to recommend that pre amp! The problem that I have, is that when you add Preamp+Poweramp+Rack casing+Cab+cables etc. It gets really expensive really fast. Im in a position where all I can spend is all I can get out of my 5150 combo. If it sells for $550, I can spend about $600. I also heard the Carvin Quad Preamp and the ADA MP-1/2 preamps can get me what I want for a bit cheaper.

All in all, I think Im going to stay with combos. Theyre just convenient for me. Im only 17, I dont need pro gear, I just want the sound I get in my head. Im going to look for old Mesa Mark amps and DC amps.

 

[Whoopysnorp]

Well, saving up extra for a Mark III isn't a bad idea either. I am now on my second Mark III. The old one was a rackmount blue stripe head, which was always a little more fizzly than I wanted it to be, but now I'm using a purple stripe long head with the R2 mod, and it is great. Combos will run you more than the heads obviously. With the Studio Preamp, you don't necessarily have to invest in more gear, though. Depends on whether you want to gig with it or not. For jamming at home, the un-racked preamp run into the effects loop of your 5150 should be more than adequate. Just something to think about. If you ultimately want to gig with it (and of course you do), the Mark III is probably the ticket.

 

[needsmoregear12]

Yea, Im going to want to be gigging with it soon And I just dont want to run it through the 5150 return.

Im honestly not happy with my 5150 combo, to me its like a 6.5/10 for what I want. The Randall I just got is like a 4/10.

The 5150 is closer, but still not worth keeping...

 

[Whoopysnorp]

Cool man, good luck in your tone search. When looking at Mark IIIs, my advice is to lean towards the earlier revisions if possible (no stripe/black dot, purple stripe, red stripe). The blue stripe was the second to last revision, and it had a bit more gain, but to my ear it was more fizzy. Those amps evolved according to '80s tastes. Oh, and if you can find one that has had the R2 mod done to it, that's a plus too, because R2 is a way underrated channel on those amps when you can bring it up to the proper level.

 

[needsmoregear12]

Thank you very much! How do you feel about the Green Stripe? I heard that one was closer to a Mark IV?

Ill take your info into account if I come across one =)