Question about gain and Boosts.

[srrdude]

My treadplate's gain is at about 3 o clock, but my xl goes all the way up. I love it, but i want to give it a little kick for solos. I Got an MXR micro amp that i run up front because it kicks my blackface's gain up to a beautiful tone, but with the gain dimed on the XL punching the micro amp doesnt give me anymore noticeable gain or volume (whereas i get both gain and volume on my blackface...which has the gain at about 5' o clock).

Now i know if i put the mxr through the FX loop i can use it as a Volume boost, but doing so stops me from using it as a clean gain boost for the blackface (all i get is more volume) which is what i got the pedal for in the first place.

So my question is, what should i do to get that extra kick? A different pedal up front like a tube screamer or something? I'm open to suggestions.

 

[Jaded Faith]

Boosting is a funny thing and confusing until one day when the light goes on. I think of it three ways: clean boost up front, gain boost up front and volume boost in the loop.

You are already using the clean boost up front. I do the same with a SD-1 I modded and will be adding a second one soon. One for pure clean boost and another for a little grit. This application has two perks. It can push the front end harder and make a clean amp start to break up. It also adds it's own flavor to the mix and that's the beauty. My modded SD-1's add a slight mid bump and tighten the lows so it's a different flavor to give me options, which I love.

You already get the gain boost idea, but that's no going to work with your UXL if the gain is already dimed. There just isn't any room left to add more gain really. You would expect to hear little to no change either clean or gain boosting a dimed high gain module that's maxed out. I typically run my module gains between 12 and 2:00 if I want to gain boost them.

I think the only choice you are going to have is a second boost in the loop to bump your volume or reevaluate the way you are approaching your boost.

 

[srrdude]

Thats kinda what i figured. So im thinking if i get a tubescreamer up front, i can use the micro amp for a nice breakup/volume on the blackface and use the tubescreamer to boost the volume and slightly color my tone on the treadplate and the xl. Sound about right?

 

[okstrat]

You're not going to get a volume boost if you're running ANY pedal in the front of an amp with much gain at all.

Pete

 

[srrdude]

even if i crank the level on the pedal?

 

[kbause]

i cant imagine using the ultra xl maxed out witha boost, honestly think u should roll that gain off a bit.

 

[srrdude]

i cant imagine using the ultra xl maxed out witha boost, honestly think u should roll that gain off a bit.

I knew someone would suggest that.

You want more gain...back off the gain.

I happen to like it where it is.

 

[SacredGroove]

If I'm understanding your original post correctly, why not get another MicroAmp? One for out front and one for the loop.

 

[srrdude]

If I'm understanding your original post correctly, why not get another MicroAmp? One for out front and one for the loop.

Thats a fair suggestion. At first i was thinking tube screamer up front, but Pete, the all knowing guy he is, pointed out that it wouldnt do much. I dug up a boss metal zone and dimed the level up front...and it did nothing to the xl but make it more noisy, so i guess a tubescreamer would be the same.

Now another micro amp in the loop would certainly give me a volume boost on both my treadplate and xl. But perhaps a Tubescreamer in the loop would give me more options, certainly a volume boost and perhaps color my ton a bit?

 

[riff man]

If I'm understanding your original post correctly, why not get another MicroAmp? One for out front and one for the loop.

Thats a fair suggestion. At first i was thinking tube screamer up front, but Pete, the all knowing guy he is, pointed out that it wouldnt do much. I dug up a boss metal zone and dimed the level up front...and it did nothing to the xl but make it more noisy, so i guess a tubescreamer would be the same.

Now another micro amp in the loop would certainly give me a volume boost on both my treadplate and xl. But perhaps a Tubescreamer in the loop would give me more options, certainly a volume boost and perhaps color my ton a bit?

correct me if i'm wrong !! ( as it happens all the time !!! :lol: )but there would be a noticable difference between a Metal zone's effect on "boosting" than a tube screamer ... the metal zone isn't designed for "boosting" i think it's meant more for it's "own" pre-amp thing....

srrdude i kinda thought the same way you did until i tried a pedal more suited for "boosting" ... i'm no expert on this subjet as i only apply a boost once in a while and it's only for lead work .... their are quite a few members here who have a great deal of knowledge for boosting ...

cheers
cheers

 

[srrdude]

If I'm understanding your original post correctly, why not get another MicroAmp? One for out front and one for the loop.

Thats a fair suggestion. At first i was thinking tube screamer up front, but Pete, the all knowing guy he is, pointed out that it wouldnt do much. I dug up a boss metal zone and dimed the level up front...and it did nothing to the xl but make it more noisy, so i guess a tubescreamer would be the same.

Now another micro amp in the loop would certainly give me a volume boost on both my treadplate and xl. But perhaps a Tubescreamer in the loop would give me more options, certainly a volume boost and perhaps color my ton a bit?

correct me if i'm wrong !! ( as it happens all the time !!! :lol: )but there would be a noticable difference between a Metal zone's effect on "boosting" than a tube screamer ... the metal zone isn't designed for "boosting" i think it's meant more for it's "own" pre-amp thing....

srrdude i kinda thought the same way you did until i tried a pedal more suited for "boosting" ... i'm no expert on this subjet as i only apply a boost once in a while and it's only for lead work .... their are quite a few members here who have a great deal of knowledge for boosting ...

cheers
cheers

A metal zone isnt designed for boosting..this is true. But a micro amp is, and that wont do it on a dimed module up front, it can only add volume through the loop. Putting it in the loop will add volume, but no dirt. I imagine a Tube screamer up front will add nothing, since neither the mxr or the boss did. But im hoping a tube screamer in the loop can add dirt and volume to a dimed module.

 

[SacredGroove]

If I'm understanding your original post correctly, why not get another MicroAmp? One for out front and one for the loop.

Thats a fair suggestion. At first i was thinking tube screamer up front, but Pete, the all knowing guy he is, pointed out that it wouldnt do much. I dug up a boss metal zone and dimed the level up front...and it did nothing to the xl but make it more noisy, so i guess a tubescreamer would be the same.

Now another micro amp in the loop would certainly give me a volume boost on both my treadplate and xl. But perhaps a Tubescreamer in the loop would give me more options, certainly a volume boost and perhaps color my ton a bit?

You might also want to consider an eq pedal (MXR 6 or 10 band?) in the loop. That should get you more control over volume and tone.

Front end boosting can only get you so much volume and gain, like Jaded Faith pointed out. The U/XL has tons of gain and by diming the gain and pushing it with a MicroAmp, you're only gonna get more compression, and the more compression you get, the more noise you'll get.

In the case of your Blackface, you're getting a boost, in both gain and volume, because you haven't crossed the mystical line into hyper-drive compression like you would have with a high gain module, if that makes any sense...LOL. Just something to keep in mind. :wink:

 

[srrdude]

If I'm understanding your original post correctly, why not get another MicroAmp? One for out front and one for the loop.

Thats a fair suggestion. At first i was thinking tube screamer up front, but Pete, the all knowing guy he is, pointed out that it wouldnt do much. I dug up a boss metal zone and dimed the level up front...and it did nothing to the xl but make it more noisy, so i guess a tubescreamer would be the same.

Now another micro amp in the loop would certainly give me a volume boost on both my treadplate and xl. But perhaps a Tubescreamer in the loop would give me more options, certainly a volume boost and perhaps color my ton a bit?

You might also want to consider an eq pedal (MXR 6 or 10 band?) in the loop. That should get you more control over volume and tone.

Front end boosting can only get you so much volume and gain, like Jaded Faith pointed out. The U/XL has tons of gain and by diming the gain and pushing it with a MicroAmp, you're only gonna get more compression, and the more compression you get, the more noise you'll get.

In the case of your Blackface, you're getting a boost, in both gain and volume, because you haven't crossed the mystical line into hyper-drive compression like you would have with a high gain module, if that makes any sense...LOL. Just something to keep in mind. :wink:

i think i follow you. Now a ts9 in the loop...would that result in just more compression? If it does i think im missing something because it seems like it would add volume and dirt.

 

[SacredGroove]

If I'm understanding your original post correctly, why not get another MicroAmp? One for out front and one for the loop.

Thats a fair suggestion. At first i was thinking tube screamer up front, but Pete, the all knowing guy he is, pointed out that it wouldnt do much. I dug up a boss metal zone and dimed the level up front...and it did nothing to the xl but make it more noisy, so i guess a tubescreamer would be the same.

Now another micro amp in the loop would certainly give me a volume boost on both my treadplate and xl. But perhaps a Tubescreamer in the loop would give me more options, certainly a volume boost and perhaps color my ton a bit?

You might also want to consider an eq pedal (MXR 6 or 10 band?) in the loop. That should get you more control over volume and tone.

Front end boosting can only get you so much volume and gain, like Jaded Faith pointed out. The U/XL has tons of gain and by diming the gain and pushing it with a MicroAmp, you're only gonna get more compression, and the more compression you get, the more noise you'll get.

In the case of your Blackface, you're getting a boost, in both gain and volume, because you haven't crossed the mystical line into hyper-drive compression like you would have with a high gain module, if that makes any sense...LOL. Just something to keep in mind. :wink:

i think i follow you. Now a ts9 in the loop...would that result in just more compression? If it does i think im missing something because it seems like it would add volume and dirt.

In the loop, it should add volume and dirt. You're understanding is right. Not sure how much dirt you'll notice, though, since you have a ton already.

 

[srrdude]

haha indeed, i dont expect to be able to hear the dirt much, but i was thinking a volume boost with a slight change in tones, maybe add mids. I realize this could also be achieved with an eq (i think) but having he screamer i think gives me more options.