RM50 effects loop problem - certain pedals not working

[mrtatemyballs]

Hey folks. Looking for your experiences regarding the rm50 combo SERIES effects loop. Sorry, long post....just want to be thorough.

Here is the effects chain:

send>ebtech line shifter>visual sound volume pedal>EHX deluxe memory boy>rocktron cyborg programmable digital reverb>ebtech line shifter>return jack.

Here is my problem:

The volume pedal works FINE. On 10 gain is unity and clean and pretty as it should be.

When I use either the memory boy or the reverb pedal, both of those pedals add a severe amount of disortion to the chain making it impossible to get a clean tone.

To troubleshoot I used each pedal indivually with just the ebtech and 1 pedal in the loop. Here are the results:

Visual Volume: works like it is suppoed to . Unity gain at 10, no sound at 0. Clean, quiet....no artifacts or distortion enter into the signal.

Rocktron Reverb: adds unpleasant disortion to the signal. Impossible to get a true clean tone from the amp. Overall Volume drops 3 db or so. Distortion is introduced whether the pedal is bypassed or not as it is not a true bypass pedal.

EHX deluxe memory boy: When bypassed there is no change to the signal. When engaged, the volume drops drastically. I can make up the gain loss with the gain knob on the pedal, but by the time I am back to unity the pedal has introduced so much distortion that it is unusable. The higher the gain on the pedal, the more distortion I get.

Next I tried each pedal running in front of the amp, no effects loop involved. All pedals work fine.....just like they should, so it's not an issue with the pedals malfunctioning.

I also plugged a cable into the send and plugged the other end of the same cable back into the return, and there was no change in sound.

Just to exhaust all possibilities I changed out the tube that drives the effects loop. No change.

i also tried without the ebtech, just to see, and it was even worse.


I find it hard to believe that I can't use these pedals in the loop since I got the ebtech deal. Those 2 pedals are a pretty important part of that I do with my set up, and may be an MTS deal breaker if I can't get it working correctly. The way I use them, I need them AFTER the pre-amp so I need them in the loop.

Any ideas?

 

[VitaminG]

hot loop. the ebtech mustn't be reducing the signal far enough for your pedals to handle it.

Have you tried turning down the module volumes and turn your MV instead?

 

[mrtatemyballs]

I have not. Will try this first thing in the AM and post an update. Thanks.

 

[VitaminG]

I have the gain on my JF OD Special on 1 to use it has a clean channel. Its volume has to stay below 10 o'clock or my Flashback delay starts clipping. The Flashback has a lot of headroom - around 6db - but the loop is just too hot. I believe TC's more expensive delays have 16db of headroom, so they might be worth checking out.

It is a very loud module though - 10 o'clock with the gain on 1 is as loud as the 59RR with vol. and gain on noon in JCM mode.

Are you sure you have the ebtech setup correctly? Doesn't it cut the incoming signal to -10db?

 

[mrtatemyballs]

Yes, ebtech set up correctly. Just to make sure I switched everything backwards and it was nothing but distortion. Even worse.

Send>into the ebtech +4>out the ebtech -10 into my pedals>back into the ebtech -10>out the ebtech +4>return

 

[Jaded Faith]

Try the modules at around 11:00 and compensate at the Master on the amp.

For an additional test to make sure it's hooked up correctly, try unplugging the two loop cables at the amp. Hit a chord. Plug them back in. Is the level the same? If not, the Ebtech isn't hooked up correctly.

 

[mrtatemyballs]

OK guys, turning down the module volumes to about "3" and turning up the master a bit has fixed the problem. Effects sound really clean now.

Only problem is the amp doesn't sound NEARLY as good with the module volumes that low. I was running them at about 7.

Oh well. Still sounds good, just more fizzy and less crisp.

What a boneheaded design for an effects loop. I have had amps from marshall, mesa, orange, soldano and never had any issues like this before.

 

[mrtatemyballs]

Just found some old info on the bruce egnater loop level matcher. It has knobs to control the send/return levels.

Seems like it would fix my problem. Wonder if he still sells those?

 

[mrtatemyballs]

I also thought about a boss ls-2. Think that would work since I already have the ebtech?

It has send and return level controls for whatever is in it's loop.