Pre amp tubes

[kylendm]

Hey everyone, I think it;s time for new pre tubes. I have all EH 12ax7s in my amp and modules. I love playing heavy metal/metalcore. Anything you guys want to suggest for minimal noise with a great quality tone for metal?

 

[Bronco]

Hey everyone, I think it;s time for new pre tubes. I have all EH 12ax7s in my amp and modules. I love playing heavy metal/metalcore. Anything you guys want to suggest for minimal noise with a great quality tone for metal?

Well I think most people (me included) are in agreement that EHs are not up to standard, at least for the high gain stuff.

I've only tried JJ ECC83s, and for now that's doing the trick. I'm sure there could be better tubes, but I haven't had any reason to try any others.

I believe Salvation recommends them as well?

I recommend immediately ordering a pair -- $10 a piece from any major tube supplier, and you'll notice an immediate difference in clarity and warmth.

 

[Shinozoku]

JJs will be a bit quieter and warmer, and Tung Sols should be extremely quiet and very clear and balanced. If you wanna REALLY reduce noise though, stick a JAN 5751 in the PI position in the head. It WILL Tame the gain some, but it gets rid of quite a bit of noise (so I hear) caused by the high gain. And if it sounds like it will lower gain: It will NOT turn your Ultra into a JTM if that's what you're thinking This is actually gonna be the first new thing I do for my head, as I have an EHX in the PI atm for clarity and bite. I plan on getting fomr Chinese C9's and putting one in the V1 and two in my SL+ (I have some Sovtek C8's -I think- but I think Shuguang might sound better), and then the JAN in my PI.

 

[kylendm]

Should i get them for my modules or my amp or both?? lol if so ill order 10 or so but if anyone else has any other opinions it'd be nice. Also do the tubes ^ fit in 12ax7 slots?

 

[Shinozoku]

Ecc83 is just the European designation for 12AX7, and 5751 and 7025 are variants You can fit ECC83's, 5751's, 7025's, 12AT7's, 12AU7's, and 12AY7's in those slots.

 

[kylendm]

I don't understand a lot of people use the EHXs to lower noise but i think mine are very noisy. especially in my XTC.

I think i'm going to go with a Jan like shin said and order 2 jj 12ax7s and 2 tung-sols. I'll swap them and choose what i want. Are the gold ones any better than the normal?

 

[Shinozoku]

I don't understand a lot of people use the EHXs to lower noise but i think mine are very noisy. especially in my XTC.

I think i'm going to go with a Jan like shin said and order 2 jj 12ax7s and 2 tung-sols. I'll swap them and choose what i want. Are the gold ones any better than the normal?

I actually though my EHX gave me more noise, but better clarity.

The gold ones are maybe a bit better. I guess it's like the difference between a fresh picked apple and an apple picked the day before. People tend to like to use the gold pins in the amp V1 though, if you're thinking about it. So get one regular and one gold pin and try them out.

 

[kylendm]

Whats the V1? the first pre amp tube and V2 being second in the module? How exactly are the tubes laid out in name wise. I really don't know. haha

 

[Sampson]

Whats the V1? the first pre amp tube and V2 being second in the module?

If you look at the board where the tubes are plugged in, you'll see small white lettering and one socket is labeled V1 and the other V2.

Also you may want to check out some Ruby tubes. In some modules I really like them.

 

[Shinozoku]

Yeah, those are the module V1 and V2. But the amp itself has a V1 as well, which is the tube closest to the input jack. The guitar's signal hits that tube first, then the module V1 and then V2, then the FX Loop buffer (second amp preamp tube), then PI (tube closest to the power tubes), then, of course, the power tubes.

 

[kylendm]

Wait i dont have my rm100 with me. How many pres are in the amp itself lol

 

[JKD]

Wait i dont have my rm100 with me. How many pres are in the amp itself lol

3

 

[kylendm]

Would different tubes for the PI and FX loop buffer be better than Tung-sol 12ax7s?

 

[JKD]

Would different tubes for the PI and FX loop buffer be better than Tung-sol 12ax7s?

Never messed with the FX loop 'coz I really don't use it..I like Sovtek LPS, Mullard RI in the PI...no reason why the Tung Sol wouldn't me just as effective tho'

 

[kylendm]

Alright Thanks guys got 3 regular tung-sols and 3 gold tung-sols on the way. Just decided to do that since i found 3 of each on craigs list never used ! lol Probably gonna order a JAN 5751 too.

 

[kylendm]

Now to look for some kt88s lol

 

[crankyrayhanky]

anybody ever invest in the pricier 12ax7 tubes? Maybe for the head, or perhaps your favorite module? I just found a conncetion local and he will sell me modern production tubes at a great rate, but calls them mediocre as he usually deals with the high end stuff...what do you think- worth it for recording purposes? I see some Egnater players doing the JAN5751 (?) in their heads....

 

[KillTone]

I have become a NOS addict over the last year. I don't like encouraging people to use them because they are a finite resource.

In most modules they sound superior to new production - although my Pete Plexi seems to love any cheap tube over any NOS. You can really hear the difference in the low gain modules.

I have also tamed 2 noisey RM50's with a good Sylvania 7025 in the input position. The tone is also better, but in a way that is hard to put into words.

5751's are often recommended for V1 because they are very quiet, but they have only about 70% of the gain of a normal 12ax7. You will notice a reduction in gain overall. A lot of people use them in the PI position as well. I read a great reason for why this is a good idea, but it was pretty technical and I am sure that I can't repeat it without getting something wrong.

THIS IS IMPORTANT! - buyer beware with NOS tubes. Unless you do some homework and learn to identify them you will get burned. A lot of sellers on E-Bay sell used, worn out old tubes as NOS, while claiming that they test strong. There are also counterfeit NOS out there which are modern production tubes re-printed with vintage logos. Even some "experts" get burned once in a while. Check out the "Tube" thread on the Boogie Board for a decent quick education.

 

[Shinozoku]

I read a great reason for why this is a good idea, but it was pretty technical and I am sure that I can't repeat it without getting something wrong.

It cleans up the gain of the signal before hitting the power tubes and in the process lowers noise

 

[KillTone]

That was part of it. Here is the article I read about the PI tube:

http://www.guitaramplifierblueprinting.com/files/Phaseinverter.pdf

There were some posters with minor differences of opinion, but overall it looks like good info.