So lately i have been having an issue getting my Hi Gain modules to sounds good. I have a Jaded Faith Plexi and a SL+ through an RM4 and a RT2/50. I can get them to sound good if im standing up normaly and go side to side but when i crotch down about level with cab it loses all of its low end and all you really hear is the mids and highs. I have messed with the EQ and the density levels and nothing seemed to give me any punch or tight low end when i listen straight on level with the cab. Any suggestions? Its really frustrating me.
Problems getting a nice tone with Hi Gain?!?!?!?!
- Thread starter veets987
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Maybe it's time to try some different speakers? What are you using now? What size cabinet?
Juggernaut
Well-known member
Dont crotch down in front of it... :lol:
J/K getting right in front of the speakers like that, your gonna hear it screwy, stand back from it quite aways, that'll give you a more accurate representation of what your audience is hearing..... tweak from there
J/K getting right in front of the speakers like that, your gonna hear it screwy, stand back from it quite aways, that'll give you a more accurate representation of what your audience is hearing..... tweak from there
I have the Randall R212CBP cab.
LOL yea i will not normally be crotching down in front . Am I looking at this all wrong? Will this naturally happen? I was about 15 feet back or so and then i crotched down. My thought process was that if this cab is mic'ed it will sound quite harsh with no low end. I was thinking that at listening at that level would be a good representation of what the crowd would be hearing.
i was really getting frustrated with it to the point im thinking about selling it and moving on to something else... Hope i dont have to do that..Lately i find myself spending more time treaking my amp trying to get a good tone rather than focusing on the song.
LOL yea i will not normally be crotching down in front . Am I looking at this all wrong? Will this naturally happen? I was about 15 feet back or so and then i crotched down. My thought process was that if this cab is mic'ed it will sound quite harsh with no low end. I was thinking that at listening at that level would be a good representation of what the crowd would be hearing.
i was really getting frustrated with it to the point im thinking about selling it and moving on to something else... Hope i dont have to do that..Lately i find myself spending more time treaking my amp trying to get a good tone rather than focusing on the song.
Jaded Faith
Well-known member
You are describing a couple of different things there that really have very little to do with the amp and modules which you seem to be blaming it on. First of all you are right in front of the cones and where loads of high end energy is directed. V30's are BRUTAL with this, so that doesn't help at all. Products like beamblockers were developed for this very problem. Bass frequencies are omni-directional and longer waves than highs, so right in front of the speakers will tend to have this effect.
Keep in mind most mics have proximity effect to some degree, so they will actually overemphasize the low end when you cab is close miked. Using your ears in front of the cone isn't a fair gauge of what a mic will pick up there.
One suggestion I might offer if you think you may continually listen to your cab from that angle is replacing the V30's. There is a true love/hate thing many players have with them and you seem to dislike the very thing that many players are so attracted to them for.
Keep in mind most mics have proximity effect to some degree, so they will actually overemphasize the low end when you cab is close miked. Using your ears in front of the cone isn't a fair gauge of what a mic will pick up there.
One suggestion I might offer if you think you may continually listen to your cab from that angle is replacing the V30's. There is a true love/hate thing many players have with them and you seem to dislike the very thing that many players are so attracted to them for.
Thank you for the info Jaded and everyone. I by no means was trying to blame it on the particular modules i am using just stated what i was using so everyone had a better idea of my situation. You modules are great Jaded. I know it is probably more of a user error and was just wondering if anyone out there had some suggestions or had a similar issue and how they fixed it (EQ'in etc....) I appreciate all of the info
crankyrayhanky
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tone bra
Shinozoku
Well-known member
Another thing is, when micing a cab you don't usually place the pmic sright in the middle of the speaker. You place it off center a bit, and sometimes at an angle to face the speaker cone straight on, about 2-3 inches off center, which picks up more low end.
Julia
Well-known member
They don't call the spot directly in front of the speakers "the kill zone" for nothing.
Some guys haul their amps up on stage, take out their stratocasters, adjust the tone while standing directly in front and over the amp, which means they don't hear the highs that well since those are very directional. So the audience in the first couple rows directly in front of the guitar amps start feeling like Trotsky.
Get a couple of 1/2" or 3/4" (depending upon the thickness of the wood in the baffle) acoustic foam 12" x 12" squares. Cut a 3" hole in the center and then cut them to fit in baffle in front of the speaker and mount on the grill cloth with a spray adhesive. This will drasitcally cut down on the kill zone and make your tone more even in the area within the projection zone of the speakers. For a more detailed explaination: http://jay-mitchell.com/dirmod.html Here are some pics using a Vox as an example:
You can get the foam at McMaster-Carr: http://www.mcmaster.com/# part number 85735K72
Some guys haul their amps up on stage, take out their stratocasters, adjust the tone while standing directly in front and over the amp, which means they don't hear the highs that well since those are very directional. So the audience in the first couple rows directly in front of the guitar amps start feeling like Trotsky.
Get a couple of 1/2" or 3/4" (depending upon the thickness of the wood in the baffle) acoustic foam 12" x 12" squares. Cut a 3" hole in the center and then cut them to fit in baffle in front of the speaker and mount on the grill cloth with a spray adhesive. This will drasitcally cut down on the kill zone and make your tone more even in the area within the projection zone of the speakers. For a more detailed explaination: http://jay-mitchell.com/dirmod.html Here are some pics using a Vox as an example:
You can get the foam at McMaster-Carr: http://www.mcmaster.com/# part number 85735K72
Jaded Faith
Well-known member
Yes you can and chances are I'll fill your order too since that's my day gig! :lol:Julia said:
No worries about anything said earlier veets, just trying to help you out and give some insight before you would go and try replacing your amp and possibly wasting a load of cash for the same results.
What the Hell !!! A love hate relationship with my v30's is an understatement. I stumbled upon this post at about 9:30 this morning and I made it my mission today to get the foam and do up one cab this way.
unbelievable !!!!
Too much presence, or highs, scooped mids or not, crank the bass, whatever. I have been a tone nut for years and this was by far the best solution for finding that grand balance of ripp'n high gain highs with extreme metal lows. I don't chime in often but I had to for this. I can't wait to do up my second cab tomorrow.
Whoever put out this link: http://jay-mitchell.com/dirmod.html
rules !!!!
Randall forum rules !!!
I am syked !!!
unbelievable !!!!
Too much presence, or highs, scooped mids or not, crank the bass, whatever. I have been a tone nut for years and this was by far the best solution for finding that grand balance of ripp'n high gain highs with extreme metal lows. I don't chime in often but I had to for this. I can't wait to do up my second cab tomorrow.
Whoever put out this link: http://jay-mitchell.com/dirmod.html
rules !!!!
Randall forum rules !!!
I am syked !!!
riff man
Well-known member
buy a GRAIL.... play through V30's .....all issues solved !!!!
SuicideCircus
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Also had this same Issue with V30's.
...bought a Lynch Cabinet. No more problems.....
...bought a Lynch Cabinet. No more problems.....
Every place you stand in front of your amp will sound different. It may sound odd but in all cases don't trust your ears 100%. When I first got my Randall I went off of people's recorded tones and demos. Then when I got all the modules I liked they sounded nothing like the demo clips. Until......I recorded them mic'd up. Everytime I mic up the amp I am amazed at the sound I get. The fact is every angle you stand at in front of your amp will have a different tone. If I stand about 15 feet away from my halfstack it sounds amazing. Walk up in front of it and put your ear in front and it is so harsh you would cry. Its just the way the speaker projects sound and more than anything the way your ear picks up frequencies. For example, If you are sitting in you car listening to the stereo it sounds great. Your 6x9's are in the bottom of the door lets say. If you opened the door and put your ear in front of it you would think your speaker is all jacked up. It would be all midrange and treble and make your ear bleed. Sit back in your seat and close the door and you are back in business. Its just all the way the speaker projects sound and your ears. Stick a mic in front of your amp and record it and you will be amazed at how different your favorite tone will sound. More than likely it may be your favorite tone standing in your jam room but with an SM57 or another mic it will need to be completely changed.