Need some cab advice: Engl / Randall ?

[m0jo]

Buy a used Engl, Hughes & Kettner, Diezel, Orange, or Marshall cabinet that's loaded with Celestion Vintage 30s or whatever Celestion speaker is in use.

Custom made cabs can sound better but you will take a beating on resale. If you buy used you won't take a beating.

Name brands have better resale. And make sure you get black tolex unless you get an Orange which will be orange by default.

Thanks for the advice. I really went away from second-hand because there's not much on offer around here..
Most of it is very beat up or Marshall JCM900 cabs, which as I said I don't like very much. Or worst of all, very beat up Marshall.. :lol:
Also I don't plan on reselling any time soon

I will keep an eye on the marketplaces though.. maybe a gem passes by.
Somehow they only do when I don't have any money, and are all gone when I do :lol:

 

[Mattfig]

I have the R412NXT with the neo speakers and it kills on tone but doesn't kill your back to lift!

They sound great even at low volumes...Plus, you get the MTS cabinet simulation too! Great for recording...

 

[Goldfish]

Orange are very good cabs, and was on the list, but is a bit expensive.
Also I don't quite agree with the tone of it, a bit too mid-heavy (and slightly muddyish).

Yes, that's what I found. Works for some things, less so for others.

Thanks for the input Goldfish, I checked Zilla out. They have around the same prices as TubeTown.
I think I will e-mail him if he can make me a vertical oversized 212.
But I think TubeTown have got their stuff together a bit better, also they have the Eminence speakers that I'm after.

That's cool. Just relaying some options.

 

[hyenik]

Buy a used Engl, Hughes & Kettner, Diezel, Orange, or Marshall cabinet that's loaded with Celestion Vintage 30s or whatever Celestion speaker is in use.
Custom made cabs can sound better but you will take a beating on resale. If you buy used you won't take a beating.
Name brands have better resale. And make sure you get black tolex unless you get an Orange which will be orange by default.

Agree. I bet, that in Holand must be some market with used things....

and speakers? My personal advice is always same
distorted - V30
clean - Alnico Blue
compromise - Greenback
with these speakers you can?t go wrong, personally I don?t like Eminence, and all others are only different (not better)

good comparisons for first orientation
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jWK0sa7tlfI&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9acguJjsgDg
http://www.bobsavage.net/bogner/bogner.htm (Bogner Shiva demo 2)
http://www.matamplondon.com/clips.htm (speaker comparison test)
http://www.ultimatemetal.com/forum/andy-sneap/440066-speaker-comparison-samples-bogner-mesa-vht-finnish-magazine.html

and very complicated showing od IR (you can taste lot of speakers, mics etc..... good and not money-painfull test)
http://redwirez.com/preview.jsp?key=blank.xml

 

[m0jo]

Buy a used Engl, Hughes & Kettner, Diezel, Orange, or Marshall cabinet that's loaded with Celestion Vintage 30s or whatever Celestion speaker is in use.
Custom made cabs can sound better but you will take a beating on resale. If you buy used you won't take a beating.
Name brands have better resale. And make sure you get black tolex unless you get an Orange which will be orange by default.

Agree. I bet, that in Holand must be some market with used things....

and speakers? My personal advice is always same
distorted - V30
clean - Alnico Blue
compromise - Greenback
with these speakers you can?t go wrong, personally I don?t like Eminence, and all others are only different (not better)

good comparisons for first orientation
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jWK0sa7tlfI&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9acguJjsgDg
http://www.bobsavage.net/bogner/bogner.htm (Bogner Shiva demo 2)
http://www.matamplondon.com/clips.htm (speaker comparison test)
http://www.ultimatemetal.com/forum/andy-sneap/440066-speaker-comparison-samples-bogner-mesa-vht-finnish-magazine.html

and very complicated showing od IR (you can taste lot of speakers, mics etc..... good and not money-painfull test)
http://redwirez.com/preview.jsp?key=blank.xml

As I said, there's not much to be found here second hand.
Most of it is completely thrashed or not what I need or too expensive, believe me I've searched!

Have you tried Eminence the Governers?
It's supposed to be an upgrade to the V30, many people are very positive about them.. And they seem to me to be a nice way to get a slight compromise, but not as much as the greenbacks
I was actually thinking of instead of the Governer+Manowar to go with Governer+Wizard (which is a GH30-ish speaker, supposed to be between V30 and Greenback).

I've listened to the speaker comparisons and I like the basic tone of the V30's but not the fizz-ish nature that comes with them.. according to many people the Eminence Governers are the solution then. I hope you tried them because I'd love to know your opinion on that!

Edit: listened to the other tests, very thoroughly, my findings:
As said I like the V30 but not the fizz, you can hear it less on the song recordings but I think that's post-processing magic.
I also listened specifically to the combination of V30 and G12T75, which was my original choice, and I think it would be a good combination for the rock tones, if the fizz gets dampened a bit.
But my fear then is that it will not be good enough for the cleans..

 

[Julia]

I've had two Avatar equivalents of Orange 212 cabs. I've had one Greenback and one V30 in each. The V30s are apparently the ones that are screaming at me. I moved the speakers around so I have two of the same kind in each cabinet.

So I'll try them out, and hear the difference. Also installed the "Mitchell Donut" on the V30 cab today. I had the panels outside. Looks better now. I just hope they kill the piercing highs.

The donuts are installed in the top cabinet which is the greenbacks. I typically use the Digidesign "Classic 25" cabinet model in Eleven Free which is a Marshall 425 cabinet with Celestion Greenbacks when I record anyway. The one based on the Marshall 412 with Vintage 30s sounds fizzy and too bright. Other cabs models I have available are the Marshall 1960 with G12-65s, Mesa 412 w/ V-30s, Orange 212 w/ V-30s, Fender cab with Jensens, and a Leslie. I always go back to the Greenbacks.

 

[84Strat]

Julia - How do you like the G1265 compared to the Greenbacks?

I'm looking at a 2x12 Avatar Contemporary cab & have narrowed down my choices to Hellatone 60L (?) or WGS ET65. I have the Greenback 2x12 covered, just want something different to compliment a RM100 with Salvation mods: Deadplate w/ SLO voicing, Mamba & future Angel/Stonerverb.

The Greenback / G1265 sound the best to me. They have an open sound with good mids. To my ears, the V30 sounds honky with no bass & all the others G12H30/GT75/CL80/G12K100/etc sound distant or muffled or both.

I came across this preview speaker sound link - http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/GTRAudio

 

[Goldfish]

But my fear then is that it will not be good enough for the cleans..

Good thinking because it's a pretty good bet it won't...

It's very rare, I'd say nigh on impossible, to reach a single optimal cab/speaker combo for both great gain AND cleans. You either focus on the best for each paradigm or compromise. If I were you I'd build the cab around getting good solid gain tones (if that's where you spend most of your time) and compromise the cleans for now. You can always get another cab (and preferably amp) to maximize your cleans later.

 

[OldTimer]

To my ears, the V30 sounds honky with no bass & all the others G12H30/GT75/CL80/G12K100/etc sound distant or muffled or both.

I have an Avatar 212 traditional closed back cab with Hellatone 60Ls in it, and I can tell you it has plenty of bass response! I love it. But I think a V30 in general works best in a closed back cab if you want that low end. That being said, I've always wanted to try the ET65s too.

 

[Julia]

I listened to the "British" speakers on that web link. Of all of them in this order my top three are:

1. Celestion G12M "Greenback"
2. Celestion G12H Heritage
3. Eminence Lynch Super V12

The 1 and 2 were very very close. I don't think the G12H Heritage is worth double the price of the Greenback.

Most everything else, especially the Vintage 30, made me feel like Trotsky.

The test also confirms what I know from my own cabs which are Avatar Contemporary 212s. I hate the Vintage 30s in one, and love the Greenbacks in the other. The fact that I can get cone breakup with the MV at 10:00 on my RM100 LB is fantastic. The V30s do have more bottom with these cabs than the Greenbacks but that icepick just isn't worth it.